Re: Unleashed progress thread. (Previously Line Rider C progress thread.)

by mhenr18 Sun Dec 18, 2011 8:29 pm

I haven't built it using the Snow Leopard SDK yet, because backwards compatibility isn't something I'm going to care about until I'm done.
Either way, why aren't you using Lion?

by rabid squirrel Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:18 pm

mhenr18 wrote:I haven't built it using the Snow Leopard SDK yet, because backwards compatibility isn't something I'm going to care about until I'm done.
Either way, why aren't you using Lion?

1) costs money 2) problems with livestream 3) this is the first thing I've seen that only works on lion 4) what reasons are there for upgrading to lion?

by TheRevTastic Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:22 pm

rabid squirrel wrote:
mhenr18 wrote:I haven't built it using the Snow Leopard SDK yet, because backwards compatibility isn't something I'm going to care about until I'm done.
Either way, why aren't you using Lion?
1) costs money 2) problems with livestream 3) this is the first thing I've seen that only works on lion 4) what reasons are there for upgrading to lion?

It doesn't only work on lion

. No but really 1) All Mac lovers must spend money to have the latest and greatest mac vision. 2) I think those were fixed in the latest update 3) whelp mhenr already said this 4) awesomness thats why sir, thats why.

by mhenr18 Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:00 pm

rabid squirrel wrote:
mhenr18 wrote:I haven't built it using the Snow Leopard SDK yet, because backwards compatibility isn't something I'm going to care about until I'm done.
Either way, why aren't you using Lion?
1) costs money 2) problems with livestream 3) this is the first thing I've seen that only works on lion 4) what reasons are there for upgrading to lion?

1) $29 is too much? $29?
2) Procaster works flawlessly on my Macs.
3) I'm not a studio, do you expect me to keep my own machines running old software just to cater to the slackness of others?
4) Lion's far better than SL in every single way. The only people I've seen who haven't upgraded are either people who've pirated everything they own and can't run software updates to get their software compatible or the usual group of people that [censored] and moan about any change to anything.

Either way, I think I might have gotten it to build in a way that lets it run on SL. However, I don't have a way of checking and I don't want to release a build right now - I need to get a few more things implemented.

by rabid squirrel Wed Dec 21, 2011 12:18 am

mhenr18 wrote:
rabid squirrel wrote:
mhenr18 wrote:I haven't built it using the Snow Leopard SDK yet, because backwards compatibility isn't something I'm going to care about until I'm done.
Either way, why aren't you using Lion?
1) costs money 2) problems with livestream 3) this is the first thing I've seen that only works on lion 4) what reasons are there for upgrading to lion?

1) $29 is too much? $29?
2) Procaster works flawlessly on my Macs.
3) I'm not a studio, do you expect me to keep my own machines running old software just to cater to the slackness of others?
4) Lion's far better than SL in every single way. The only people I've seen who haven't upgraded are either people who've pirated everything they own and can't run software updates to get their software compatible or the usual group of people that [censored] and moan about any change to anything.

Either way, I think I might have gotten it to build in a way that lets it run on SL. However, I don't have a way of checking and I don't want to release a build right now - I need to get a few more things implemented.

Whoa there. Tell me one reason I should upgrade, besides playing a line rider prototype that doesn't even work yet. But don't get your undies in a bunch while not giving me one actual reason.

by TheRevTastic Wed Dec 21, 2011 12:29 am

rabid squirrel wrote:
mhenr18 wrote:
rabid squirrel wrote:
mhenr18 wrote:I haven't built it using the Snow Leopard SDK yet, because backwards compatibility isn't something I'm going to care about until I'm done.
Either way, why aren't you using Lion?
1) costs money 2) problems with livestream 3) this is the first thing I've seen that only works on lion 4) what reasons are there for upgrading to lion?

1) $29 is too much? $29?
2) Procaster works flawlessly on my Macs.
3) I'm not a studio, do you expect me to keep my own machines running old software just to cater to the slackness of others?
4) Lion's far better than SL in every single way. The only people I've seen who haven't upgraded are either people who've pirated everything they own and can't run software updates to get their software compatible or the usual group of people that [censored] and moan about any change to anything.

Either way, I think I might have gotten it to build in a way that lets it run on SL. However, I don't have a way of checking and I don't want to release a build right now - I need to get a few more things implemented.
Whoa there. Tell me one reason I should upgrade, besides playing a line rider prototype that doesn't even work yet. But don't get your undies in a bunch while not giving me one actual reason.

It was created in Steve Job's dreams.

by Votale Wed Dec 21, 2011 3:23 pm

Spoiler:

by darklight Sat Dec 31, 2011 8:11 pm

still waiting for leopard support here too, though I might just buy the new OS tonight.

by efrazable Sat Dec 31, 2011 9:08 pm

Votale wrote:
Spoiler:

Lion doesn't have Rosetta, therefore I don't like it as much as I should have. Fullscreen is nice though, for those with 11" and 13" screens. The scrollbars are also an improvement.

by I_Vermillion Sun Jan 01, 2012 9:09 pm

When I randomly scribble around lines, eventually all of the lines just turn pure black.

by [senpai] kevans Wed Jan 11, 2012 2:09 pm

Will this one support multiplayer?

by TeamBlast Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:14 pm

Keep it up!

Spoiler:

by efrazable Wed Jan 11, 2012 9:29 pm

kevansevans wrote:Will this one support multiplayer?

What is multiplayer? I don't like this idea.

Anyways, what are the chances that this will be on fp still?

by mhenr18 Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:56 am

The whole point of me doing this is to get away from the flash ecosystem and get LR running as fast as possible. You'll just run LR as a .exe or .app.

Also, multiplayer is quite interesting and I've played around with it in some builds of 6.8. It's not a priority for me at the moment, right now I'm really focusing on exactly what I want for the first release - I've written up an exact specification for what I want so I'm quite focused now. I'll share some of it here:

I've decided to use three ridable line types: standard, acceleration and single sided. Yes, I'm using double sided lines (however single sided lines are identical to Beta 2 blue lines). There will be four shades of scenery line - black and three progressively lighter greys. There will be three thicknesses of scenery line with the current thickness being the largest. There will also be two editor only lines - guide lines for track planning and whatnot and measurement lines which display their length.

During playback, VCR-style controls will appear at the top of the window (replacing the tool bar), allowing the user to fast forward, rewind, pause, step forwards or backwards, and scrub along a timeline (the timeline will extend as long as the precomputed frames and expand in realtime if more are generated during playback). The user can flag a spot on the timeline to always resume playback from. A ghost is placed on the track to show Bosh's position at this time. The timeline is placed below the controls and the controls are spaced so that a double click of the play button causes no effect. If the track is modified causing the simulation to change before the time the flag is reached, it will be removed. Modifications to the track make the timeline/frame cache regenerate fully.

EDIT: Also I figured out why sometimes placing a flag would cause Bosh to act differently in simulation so that stuff that worked when he was flagged didn't when you restarted the track. That bug's gone now Smile

All tools have a primary and secondary behaviour. The secondary behaviour is triggered by holding Shift while using the tool.

The pencil tool will be fixed to NEVER produce a line longer than 10px, unlike previous versions. It will also stop drawing if the angle between successive lines gets too large or too small (instead of just invalidating the line). The pencil's secondary behaviour sets it to draw 5px lines.

The line tool will behave identically to previous versions, snapping the temp line if the drawn line would snap to a line. Line types prefer to snap to one another, however they will snap to any other type of line. The line tool's secondary behaviour has it draw in 45 degree increments (because the only single sided line isn't an acceleration one, we don't need an inverse option).

The eraser can be resized and can be set to erase specific line types, however this is set using checkboxes under the swatches instead of selecting a swatch. This clarifies the behaviour of the eraser quite a lot - by default all types are checked but you can change them at will and there's a minimal UX penalty in reselecting all 5 checkboxes to restore the original behaviour. The eraser's secondary behaviour has it act in a lasso manner, making it draw a box whose contents are then erased.

The pan tool remains unchanged from previous versions, however its secondary behaviour is to magnify the pan effect by 10x. When using this secondary behaviour, a small purple X is rendered on the screen to show where the pan started from (when using the magnified pan, it will likely be easy to get lost as it pans a LOT faster than usual, so having a reference is useful).

The zoom tool is identical to previous versions. Its secondary behaviour is to zoom in at a target with a single click, preserving the relative location of the target in the window such that consecutive clicks zoom in at the same target.

The play button is also found in the tool panel, however it's not a tool. It just plays the track.

Undo and redo buttons are present in the tool bar. This causes the play button to be more centered (important for the transition between editing and playback). Every edit (draws and erases) is logged by the undo system and the undo log is saved with tracks. Undoing and then editing causes newer actions to be dropped from the log.

A menu button is also present in the tool bar - it brings in a menu from the left of the window containing other things.

Right now I'm redoing the entire math/physics system. Why? I want tracks to simulate in the exact same way on ANY machine, regardless of processor/OS. What I've done is change from using floating point math to fixed point math using 5 decimal places. Also, I'm now using a fully internationalised text system - soon I'll be posting requests for translations of strings into people's native languages.

by TheRevTastic Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:00 am

You just made me need a new pair of undies.

~the guy that's a turtle

by mhenr18 Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:06 am

also, I mentioned precomputed frames in the previous post. I guess I should explain them:

Frames are to precomputed in a worker thread, allowing for random access to frames. Tracks are deemed to "end" after Bosh has fallen for 5 seconds without getting closer to any lines, or if he is at a speed lower than 0.05 pixels/frame for more than 5 seconds. The renderer will interpolate frames for a smooth 60fps if there are precomputed frames available, otherwise it will just display at 40fps and frames will be computed on-the-fly and added to the precomputed frame cache.

by darklight Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:13 am

urrrgh I just tried to buy lion, but I don't have enough memory. you need 2gb, but I only have 1gb lol. oh well, my mom has an old gateway laptop that should fit my needs.

by TheRevTastic Thu Jan 12, 2012 9:21 am

Kramwood wrote:^can't put mac os on anything, but a macintosh or a Hackintosh.

I believe he meant he will be using the laptop for windows.

by rabid squirrel Thu Jan 12, 2012 10:20 am

mhenr18 wrote:I've decided to use three ridable line types: standard, acceleration and single sided. Yes, I'm using double sided lines (however single sided lines are identical to Beta 2 blue lines).

Um, why no single sided acceleration lines?

by [senpai] kevans Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:21 am

mhenr18 wrote:also, I mentioned precomputed frames in the previous post. I guess I should explain them:

Frames are to precomputed in a worker thread, allowing for random access to frames. Tracks are deemed to "end" after Bosh has fallen for 5 seconds without getting closer to any lines, or if he is at a speed lower than 0.05 pixels/frame for more than 5 seconds. The renderer will interpolate frames for a smooth 60fps if there are precomputed frames available, otherwise it will just display at 40fps and frames will be computed on-the-fly and added to the precomputed frame cache.

I don't like that idea, can you make this feature a toggle option?

EDIT: The reason I say this is because Unbound had that feature, and it was extremely annoying. Every time I crashed, or if it thought I wasn't moving, It decided I was done.

by hypothet Thu Jan 12, 2012 4:25 pm

kevansevans wrote:
mhenr18 wrote:also, I mentioned precomputed frames in the previous post. I guess I should explain them:

Frames are to precomputed in a worker thread, allowing for random access to frames. Tracks are deemed to "end" after Bosh has fallen for 5 seconds without getting closer to any lines, or if he is at a speed lower than 0.05 pixels/frame for more than 5 seconds. The renderer will interpolate frames for a smooth 60fps if there are precomputed frames available, otherwise it will just display at 40fps and frames will be computed on-the-fly and added to the precomputed frame cache.

I don't like that idea, can you make this feature a toggle option?

EDIT: The reason I say this is because Unbound had that feature, and it was extremely annoying. Every time I crashed, or if it thought I wasn't moving, It decided I was done.

Agreed. Toggle for this feature.

For everything else, I'd say that this is everything that Unbound wanted to be.

by mhenr18 Thu Jan 12, 2012 4:39 pm

rabid squirrel wrote:
mhenr18 wrote:I've decided to use three ridable line types: standard, acceleration and single sided. Yes, I'm using double sided lines (however single sided lines are identical to Beta 2 blue lines).
Um, why no single sided acceleration lines?

I couldn't think of any reason to keep them.

As for the track ending, that's only for the frame cache. The track doesn't actually stop.

by hypothet Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:04 pm

mhenr18 wrote:
rabid squirrel wrote:
mhenr18 wrote:I've decided to use three ridable line types: standard, acceleration and single sided. Yes, I'm using double sided lines (however single sided lines are identical to Beta 2 blue lines).
Um, why no single sided acceleration lines?

I couldn't think of any reason to keep them.

I can. Keep 'em.

by mhenr18 Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:10 pm

List some.

by hypothet Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:23 pm

mhenr18 wrote:List some.

Kay.

You can accelerate on one side. (great for acceleration on one side, and contact on one side when needed)

You pass through on the other (great for large/compact tracks/quirks)

Red g-wells work differently than blue g-wells, and have multiple uses (see above).

Why would you be keeping a one-sided normal line and not a one-sided acceleration line?

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