Let's talk about this new version + Future ideas

Ph0enix wrote:

rich wrote:

HG42 wrote:Drawing inside the start point.

Is a must.

Thanks.

I really really agree with this too.

Those. ^

Sorry, that's going to take some time. Because of how flash works, it wont allow me to toggle it's "click-ability". sorry. Like, I know you can turn on and of the click-ability of the UI buttons, but the start point isn't a button, so yeah. I'll figure something out.

Okay guys, starting on 3.3. First Issue I'm going to target is the draw-in-start-point feature!

I shall go through this list and see what I'll try to add or not.

Glitches/Bugs/Fixes
Tab Key: In 6.2, tab zooms out to show the whole track in the screen. When pressed again, it zoomed back in to the previous zoom level, at wherever the mouse was. This feature was missing in 6.7.
- okay

Slow Blinking: Make Bosh blink slower in slow motion, so when he is recorded in slow motion and then sped up he isn't blinking super fast.
- okay.

Fix broken sled: If you go off sled, mark a flag, the sled breaks, and then you press play, the sled doesn't fix itself and is still broken. Fix this.
- don't really see the point

Disable hotkeys when viewing the help page (except for H of course, so you can get back). This will prevent people from getting stuck on the help page and having to close Line Rider, losing work.
-on it.

Ability to draw inside the start button
- on it.

Sometimes tools besides the pencil tool act like the pencil tool. Causes unclear.
- unaware myself, on it.

Fix the speedometer: It's accurate if you are traveling to the lower right or upper left, but if you travel to the lower left or upper right, no matter your speed, it's nearly zero.
- on it.

Fix shift+backspace: If you erase a line early in a track and use shift+backspace to replace it, the track no longer works. Fix it so it does.
- no clue how, the re-load variables are exactly the same.

DON'T Fix These Glitches (actually, include them in the help file)

Multiple Line Glitch: When you draw a line, press Y, then click the stop button, it makes a duplicate of that line.

Relatively Simple Additions (that we basically all agree on)
Frame Counter: The timer, when clicked, would change into a frame counter, which would start at 0 and add 1 every frame, and would change back if you clicked it again. This would be very helpful for speed contests and challenges. A third mode would be great too, that would show seconds:frames/40. (e.g. 12:37 = 12 seconds, 37 frames) Clicking on it could cycle through these three.
-Already done, with a #/40 indicator, now has the useless 40 removed

Recording Mode: When a certain key is pressed (you pick) the game would shift into "recording mode" and run at 2 fps until the key is pressed again.
-Going to add a 2fps with no UI option along with the auto-slow

Auto Slow Motion: When you are in play mode and in slow motion and press Y, have Bosh start in slow motion.
-3.2 already does that, but 3.3 will give you that option to be turned on or off

More Deletion Safety: Have the game ask you "Are you sure?" when you either delete a save, or load a save when the current opened track has unsaved changes.
- done
XY snap Mid-Draw: If you start drawing a line, then press X, have the line snap to XY.
-on it

Sticky Color Eraser: Once you've shift+clicked into color eraser, stay in color eraser whenever you select the eraser tool until you shift+click on it again.
- pointless IMO

Update the help page so it actually covers everything.
- on it

Autosaving: Recover progress if the game freezes or you accidentally close it or whatever.
-On it

Scenery Wiping: Shift+click on green swatch in color eraser, after a prompt all scenery is erased.
-on it.

Flag Lock: Shift+click on a flag locks it, so it can't be pressed normally (a visual cue would be nice, like an X over it), Shift+click again to unlock it, then it works normally again.
- already done

Make Scroll Zoom and Play Mode Zoom go in all the way as if you were using the actual zoom tool
- good idea

When you delete a track and start a new one, when you click to save make the box blank, so you don't accidentally save over the last save.
- 3.2 already has safety questions

Save the flag when you save the track
-on it

Mildly Controversial Additions

Pause Button: Allow a hotkey for pausing the track.
- 3.2 has the button, but no hot key

Frame by Frame hotkeys: When paused, have the arrow keys navigate forward and backward frame by frame.
-Frame forward is possible, but not reverse. to have a rewind as smooth as it playing forward would take up too much space.

Fast Forward and Rewind buttons: Rewind would stop or play when it reached either a flag or the beginning of a track.
- I have no idea how mhenr managed to do it, but I'm on it.

The F Key: Make the hotkey that jumps to the flag something other than F, so that on a mac someone can press Command+F to go to full screen and back without the view jumping to the flag.
-

Variable eraser size: a way to adjust the size of the eraser
- considering

Grabbing and moving scenery around
-maybe

Have a toggle between following rider and sled when Bosh goes off sled
- how many off sled tracks are made now a days?

One click to make a dot
- No, dots sometime will never show up in the editor or playback, ever again. this would be very frustrating if it ends up interfering with further track.

Green lines snapping to other green lines when a key is held down.
- on it
Game Changing Features (would no longer be Beta 2)

Variable Line Thicknesses
- no
Shades of grey for lines
- you really don't appreciate me doing this stuff, do you rabid?

Fill Tool
- no

Colors: either swatches or a picker
- maybe

Select/cut/copy/paste for scenery lines between saves
- no
Customizable Riders/Sleds
- no
Multiple Riders
- no
Camera controls
- line types or ones like beta 3?

Difficult Suggestions (would be awesome, but easier said than done)

A hotkey during playback to send the track into "real time" mode, where the speed is kept at 100% at the price of dropping frames, in order to help with syncing to music.
- that's what frame skipping is. But I hate frame skipping. it ends up being far more off than before. plus, you'd never be able to see the frame between each skip and tell if it is synced.

Lessen the amount of line lag.
- on it, hopefully

A button to open your .sol folder
- impossible because of flash

Save tracks to files, load tracks from files.
- tried, failed

Built-in screen capture along with interface and video file exporting.
- impossible because of flash

Track scrubbing: A slider that would fast forward when dragged forward, and rewind when dragged back.
- if rewinding isn't possible, this isn't.

Fix corruptions so they don't happen anymore.
- ...

In the Save/Load screen, when you click on a save, display date last modified and number of each type of line off to the side
- on it.

any questions?

Multiple flags, so you can quickly see if what you are doing doesn't interfere with past parts of the track (like recycling or making a part that intersects with another)

Everything else sounds fantastic

kevansevans wrote:Fix shift+backspace: If you erase a line early in a track and use shift+backspace to replace it, the track no longer works. Fix it so it does.
- no clue how, the re-load variables are exactly the same.

Lines have different effects based on the order they're drawn in. dunno why.

kevansevans wrote:Sticky Color Eraser: Once you've shift+clicked into color eraser, stay in color eraser whenever you select the eraser tool until you shift+click on it again.
- pointless IMO

It's really annoying if you're scening, and want to erase some scenery, and then you have to shift+click the eraser tool twice every time you want to erase. It's easy to mess up and erase track lines and would be much easier if it just stayed as color eraser until you shift+clicked on it again

kevansevans wrote:One click to make a dot
- No, dots sometime will never show up in the editor or playback, ever again. this would be very frustrating if it ends up interfering with further track.

The idea is not the glitchy "dots" that people can sometimes make these days, but dots that work, well, like they should. always visible, easily erasable, single point.

Also, I'd like to point out that that list is not MY suggestions, it's a compilation of everyone's suggestions/complaints. I personally don't care much for all the game changing additions and some of the mildly controversial ones, but I didn't want to only put stuff on the list if I thought it was a good idea. (e.g. the dots I describe above, I'm personally not really a fan...)

Make it so we can click on a tracks name in the save list and over write it.

I hate having to retype the name of tracks after closing and re-opening flash player.

TheRevTastic wrote:Make it so we can click on a tracks name in the save list and over write it.

I hate having to retype the name of tracks after closing and re-opening flash player.

yes this!

EDIT: added to the master list

Oh, and to just remind future comments, please download 3.2 (http://www.mediafire.com/?e5uy616s66zb79e) before you give me an idea, this is so I won't get angry at you, and eventually ignore all opinions from said person.

also, 3.3 will be my last "hax", so if you want something, now's the time.

I think I should just say it would be great to have a version that has a whole bunch of glitch fixes and little additions to make it better but no new line types. I'm sure lots of people would appreciate that.

Pretty sure you already knew this but since you're working on all this stuff I thought it would bear repeating.

Don't know if this was fixed or not but.....

Make it so when scrolling through your save list that it doesn't zoom in/out on the track in the background.

rabid squirrel wrote:I think I should just say it would be great to have a version that has a whole bunch of glitch fixes and little additions to make it better but no new line types. I'm sure lots of people would appreciate that.

Pretty sure you already knew this but since you're working on all this stuff I thought it would bear repeating.

Sorry to let you down, but pop lines are staying. Some of us see the huge potential of what these can do, and I believe someone out there will do something. The reason I'm doing this is because the only thing that can "rekindle" the flash version is a new resource. We are running out of things to do, and I don't know if you noticed this or not, but everything is the same now. You can basically break every track down to 5 things. Manual, Highspeed, Quirk, Mixture of previous 3, or Omni. (XY counts as quirk). And when you look at that, it's really only those 3 first categories. Also, all I ask is to allow these in the bare tracks section, here some happy thoughts to encourage you to do so:

KillinTime2792 wrote:new lines, deal with it. I'm having fun here.

efrazable wrote:Just used them for about half an hour, they're harder to use than they look.

pure5152 wrote:I don't know about you guys, but I toyed around with it for a couple hours and I absolutely love it. Expect a new track from me soon using the new version

Opal Rider wrote:Okay, that was just awesome. If this track doesn't make that an official version by itself alone then I don't know what will, although I now fully back this version 100%

Also, I'm not sure if you noticed this, but it is effing hard to deal with everyone's [censored] opinion. Remember that LR conservative/liberal thread, or whatever it was? you saw the spectrum.



Thought you already noticed, but since you're so inactive I thought it would bear repeating.

I'm trying my best, cut me some slack.

woop! i got quoted! and it's the top of the list!

>happy days theme song

Wait. Why do we have to toggle drawing inside a start point?

Why can't we just drag the start point with D and draw in it whenever we want?

rabid squirrel wrote:

kevansevans wrote:Fix shift+backspace: If you erase a line early in a track and use shift+backspace to replace it, the track no longer works. Fix it so it does.
- no clue how, the re-load variables are exactly the same.

Lines have different effects based on the order they're drawn in. dunno why.

I HAD THIS BUG IN MY VERSION AND IADGJERIO IT WAS SO ANNOYING how did i fix it did i even fix it
right, I forced the physics to evaluate lines in the order in which points collide with the line, and it won't be a problem for the constraints due to properties of linearity. thank god for linearity

Conundrumer wrote:

rabid squirrel wrote:

kevansevans wrote:Fix shift+backspace: If you erase a line early in a track and use shift+backspace to replace it, the track no longer works. Fix it so it does.
- no clue how, the re-load variables are exactly the same.

Lines have different effects based on the order they're drawn in. dunno why.

I HAD THIS BUG IN MY VERSION AND IADGJERIO IT WAS SO ANNOYING how did i fix it did i even fix it
right, I forced the physics to evaluate lines in the order in which points collide with the line, and it won't be a problem for the constraints due to properties of linearity. thank god for linearity

I know nothing about the coding for LR or LR versions, but is it possible that replacing the line in the beginning of the track "corrects" the errors that occur later in the track, thus making it not work?

HG42 wrote:

Conundrumer wrote:

rabid squirrel wrote:

kevansevans wrote:Fix shift+backspace: If you erase a line early in a track and use shift+backspace to replace it, the track no longer works. Fix it so it does.
- no clue how, the re-load variables are exactly the same.

Lines have different effects based on the order they're drawn in. dunno why.

I HAD THIS BUG IN MY VERSION AND IADGJERIO IT WAS SO ANNOYING how did i fix it did i even fix it
right, I forced the physics to evaluate lines in the order in which points collide with the line, and it won't be a problem for the constraints due to properties of linearity. thank god for linearity

I know nothing about the coding for LR or LR versions, but is it possible that replacing the line in the beginning of the track "corrects" the errors that occur later in the track, thus making it not work?

I really wish it was that simple. The physics are completely random and infinite in the sense of "pick a number between 1 and 10", and you can pick something as absurd as 3.5, but can't go past 10, or below 1. Somewhere in the code, it causes it to pick something other than 3.5.

As for that start point toggle, the d key will be the toggle dum dum.

Here's the list of the things I manged to get done for 3.3:

Tab Key: In 6.2, tab zooms out to show the whole track in the screen. When pressed again, it zoomed back in to the previous zoom level, at wherever the mouse was. This feature was missing in 6.7.

Make Bosh blink slower in slow motion, so when he is recorded in slow motion and then sped up he isn't blinking super fast.

Fixed pencil glitch where any other tool would act like the pencil, without even touching the pencil.

XY snap Mid-Draw: If you start drawing a line, then press X, have the line snap to XY. Includes 45 degree snap.

Scenery Wiping: Shift+click on green swatch, prompt will come up.

Made Scroll Zoom and Play Mode Zoom go in all the way as if you were using the actual zoom tool

Save/Delete/load actions in the save menu will clear the name in the menu to help prevent you saving over tracks

TheRevTastic wrote:Make it so we can click on a tracks name in the save list and over write it.

I hate having to retype the name of tracks after closing and re-opening flash player.

This is ending up being more trouble than it's worth. It produces an effect where it won't let you erase the name, and will never allow you to save properly. So, untill I have a massive brain storm, it's not going to happen.

Working really hard on this version guys

kevansevans wrote:Sorry to let you down, but pop lines are staying. Some of us see the huge potential of what these can do, and I believe someone out there will do something. The reason I'm doing this is because the only thing that can "rekindle" the flash version is a new resource. We are running out of things to do, and I don't know if you noticed this or not, but everything is the same now. You can basically break every track down to 5 things. Manual, Highspeed, Quirk, Mixture of previous 3, or Omni. (XY counts as quirk). And when you look at that, it's really only those 3 first categories.

I am well aware of your opinions on pop lines, and I am sure you are well aware of mine, but that is all IRRELEVANT.

I'm not asking you to NOT develop pop lines. I'm asking you to release another (different) version with the fixes but without new line types. (aka still the same game as 6.1/6.2/6.7, a patch that improves all the little things) It isn't going to prevent your "rekindling" in any way.

The reason you are refusing to do this is because you want to FORCE people to play with your new lines, which is just selfish and antagonistic. If pop lines are what this community needs, then you would not hesitate to make this version because you would be sure that we would all go for the version with pop lines if given the choice, and that would show me up as an added bonus.

kevansevans wrote:Thought you already noticed, but since you're so inactive I thought it would bear repeating.
I'm trying my best, cut me some slack.

You insulted me and then told me to cut you some slack? I'm not going to have any sympathy for you if you insult me and then ask for sympathy. And you obviously have an ulterior motive that is not just "trying your best"

/andimnotinactive

EDIT: Also, as I said before, your version is not allowed in the bare tracks section because it's been out for such a short time and is so little used as of now. Nobody has won a MOTW with it (compared to hundreds for 6.1-6.7), nobody has held a contest using it, nobody has cited a track made with it as a source of inspiration, and a mere handful of tracks have been made with it compared with literally HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS with 6.1-6.7. If it goes the Beta 3 route and is used a few times and then forgotten it doesn't deserve to go in the Bare Tracks section. It's currently allowed to be entered in MOTW, used in contests, and posted in the Non-Conformist Zone - much like Beta 3. If it ever achieves widespread use then of course it will be allowed in the Bare Tracks section.

kevansevans wrote:Working really hard on this version guys

Looking forward to it! Have you looked into doing multiple flags?

shotoku wrote:

kevansevans wrote:Working really hard on this version guys

Looking forward to it! Have you looked into doing multiple flags?

Thought about it, but there isn't an adequate way to organize them. 8.0 tried to do multiple flags, but that ended up being a pain in the ass and adding more lag.

I kinda detest multiple flags.

Cereal wrote:I kinda detest multiple flags.

Good thing they're not coming around then

rabid squirrel wrote:I'm not asking you to NOT develop pop lines. I'm asking you to release another (different) version with the fixes but without new line types. (aka still the same game as 6.1/6.2/6.7, a patch that improves all the little things) It isn't going to prevent your "rekindling" in any way.

Can't you just, not use pop lines? why do we need an entirely different version for this? in case you click on it by accident?
removing them, just releasing a version with everything the same but removing pop lines, would be a waste of time. It's like asking for an entirely new version of CoD without the single player because you don't want to play the campaign.

He's right actually. I'll be releasing two different versions. I'll release the one without the new lines first,n] then after awhile, Ill do the one with the new lines.

Since this will be your last version, there's no chance of attracting-repelling lines, right?