The/A Problem of Line Rider.

Votale wrote:1. Stop making tracks that are impossible to make and discourage riders from releasing their creations because they see something from Kram and say "Wow mines like crap compared to that." Instead, make tracks that can be looked up to and admired that make people say "Woah I would love to do that." That way they release tracks and become better and better and well, I think you get the rest. Be the new ZNF.

People had this same argument in 2008, except inversed - that ZNF was scaring people away from Line Rider.

TigerXLine wrote:* Every who is beasts at Line Rider quits. From what I've read above, the problem is that none have the guts to keep training them selves or deal with not being as good as Aspi or Kram... (This suggestion was a joke, but also a point).

Did you seriously just suggest that? Did you seriously just ask all of the LCC to quit so that there will be more activity in Line Rider?

Ktk wrote:Flaws in the system
- Attention span has effectively been cut in half. In 2008 we had 2:30 tracks. Now 1:30 is "long"? Either modern riders have condensed quirk so much that they can fit 2:30 of effort into 0:50, and/or users have just lost motivation to create longer tracks.

I think both. But yes. This is very true.

Ktk wrote:- Yeah you can't go wrong with advertising a website, this is true... But elitelinerider.com rolls off the tongue a tad smoother than iridethelines.forumotion.com.

I think WeRidetheLines.com rolls off the tongue just fine.

I think a big problem we have not yet addressed is this:

• There are people who play for fun, and there are people who play to get better
  
• There is some overlap, but it's growing smaller as standard are raised
  
• There are also a lot of people who claim to play for fun but it's not really true
  
• When people no longer play for fun, they say they play Line Rider, but more often they just hang out here and occasionally attempt to work on something, and often eventually stop kidding themselves and just hang out
  
• If people play for fun and don't care about standards, they are less likely to share their tracks
  
• If someone who has decided not to care as much about standards does post their track, it's likely to get highly negative feedback because it's not as good as past tracks by them
  
• This happens even with tracks people do work hard on, and can be extremely devastating

This is a highly complex and interrelated issue, but I think you see what I'm getting at. The structure of our community can be heavily discouraging.

hmm... I wonder what sub-machinima group line rider would go in. (Realm? Respawn?)

However, I doubt that machinima would put up videos of some free online internet flash game....

We need more scenery, advertising, tutorials, advertising, and advertising.

Rabid, did you not read what Tiger put in the parenthesis? That that was a joke? Lrn2read.

Msn convo:
Even if we did get new members they would end up leaving anyway because they would see all these wonderful colorful names and they would have no way of ever getting one themselves. they would feel too inferior to even stay.

the ranks we have now are pointless and impossible to get
elite does nothing
legend does nothing
lcc barely does stuff
retired staff, why have it?
the only thing we need is mods and admins. the rest of the ranks are for show.

all this advertising for what? a few more posts and a couple nooby tracks? they'll be gone within a month and find other fun stuff to do. if we're trying to get new members and actually get them to stay, we need to make some huge changes.

I play for fun, as in, I have fun while I play Line Rider. It's just that I enjoy trying out the new tricks and trying to find new ones and becoming "better" at Line Rider. The more tricks I know, the more variety I can give my tracks. So there should be a group of riders that play for fun to get better And taking some hard critism, or people not liking my tracks is ok with me, not everyone can like what I make, that's quite impossible. Nothing can be liked by everyone

Also, all my real releases have been around 2 minutes I think and I'm someone who doesn't quit easily.
I lol'd at what rabid said about me.
It's like I'm being the kramwood of 2008 and being the owly of 2011 =p
You guys probably don't know owly, but rabid will understand ^^

TheRevTastic wrote:Rabid, did you not read what Tiger put in the parenthesis? That that was a joke? Lrn2read.

I can read. He said "but also a point".

Wizzy wrote:Msn convo:
Even if we did get new members they would end up leaving anyway because they would see all these wonderful colorful names and they would have no way of ever getting one themselves. they would feel too inferior to even stay.

If all they care about is a rank, I'm glad they're leaving.

Wizzy wrote:the ranks we have now are pointless and impossible to get
elite does nothing
legend does nothing
lcc barely does stuff
retired staff, why have it?
the only thing we need is mods and admins. the rest of the ranks are for show.

Irrelevant much? Sounds like whining about ranks to me. I hate it when people whine about ranks, it's always passive-aggressive desire for them, or else they would just not care.

Wizzy wrote:all this advertising for what? a few more posts and a couple nooby tracks? they'll be gone within a month and find other fun stuff to do. if we're trying to get new members and actually get them to stay, we need to make some huge changes.

Truth, but I don't think anyone has any idea what these "huge changes" are, and I don't think there are any "huge changes" that we could do or that would work. Any ideas?

Z_N-Freak wrote:I play for fun, as in, I have fun while I play Line Rider. It's just that I enjoy trying out the new tricks and trying to find new ones and becoming "better" at Line Rider. The more tricks I know, the more variety I can give my tracks. So there should be a group of riders that play for fun to get better And taking some hard critism, or people not liking my tracks is ok with me, not everyone can like what I make, that's quite impossible. Nothing can be liked by everyone
Also, all my real releases have been around 2 minutes I think and I'm someone who doesn't quit easily.

1. You said that you were out of inspiration after KING because "everyone keeps expecting that whatever I make has to be better than my last track"
2. I said there was some overlap
3. You quit for quite a long while

Z_N-Freak wrote:I lol'd at what rabid said about me.
It's like I'm being the kramwood of 2008 and being the owly of 2011 =p
You guys probably don't know owly, but rabid will understand ^^

It's as simple as this, Linerider is old.

It's old.

Old.

This situation could be compared to what is plaguing myspace and other older social media sites.

I think if line rider is getting old, the answer would be scenery. How could scenery possibly get old? Drawing never gets old for me? I would make a basic flatsled track just to be able to scene it. Art is infinite.

Brandon971 wrote:I think if line rider is getting old, the answer would be scenery. How could scenery possibly get old? Drawing never gets old for me? I would make a basic flatsled track just to be able to scene it. Art is infinite.

Probably because of the incredibly criticizing feedback that is often given to scenery tracks on this site, and the enormous time it takes to draw scenery.

No, it's just old. You playing linerider more won't make it new.

Making 200 Evolutions of Lineriders won't make it new, it may bring in a few more members, but a equal number will leave.

You don't seam to understand that EVERYONE is what's making the site elitist. A simple solution to help the problem would be getting ride of LCC, which is elitist central, and stopping all competitive nature in LR, which won't happen. Just sayin', if you're complaining that LR is too elitist, stop recognizing the people who are amazing at LR, which is what I assume Wizzy meant.


So, boo hoo, so sad. Just lock it.

Scenery is dead because nobody makes tracks that are even right for scenery anymore.

It seems like tutorials, considering that is something new members ask for, would be a nice addition. I'll get working on some

I like how everyone's ignoring my completely reasonable reasoning for why this thread is stupid.

Making new threads or tuts won't help bring activity for others, it will make you more active, sure. I doubt it will stop the elitist nature of linerider that you all are bawling about. It's just going to teach people how to be more elitist.

You'll contradict yourselves.

You really get on my nerves sometimes rabid. Whenever someone brings up ranks it's automatically considered whining. Idk If you know this, but I chose to demote myself. And how is it irrelevant? Were talking about new members and what their going to do here.

Edit: and I'm for getting rid of ranks entirely.

You know what, I don't know if I'm even staying much longer. The forum sucks and is half dead. If you want help, ask for it from more successful forums. Stop [censored] about how lr is dying cause nobody cares at this moment. We talk about doin things to get more noticed but I don't think we have the slightest clue what were doing. And rabid, I thought you were leaving. We could use a leader that knows what he's doing. Not saying that you are one.

Maybe you should try to give more reasoning for why each rank should be demoted rather then posting in a way that can be considered as whining.

I already did. Theyre pointless to have. Any more reason to get rid of them? That's not even the point. All I'm trying to say is if I were a new Member I'd be gone pretty quick. Today I went on YouTube and put up ads on all my videos with a lot of views in some sort of attempt to get people interested in the site. I want to help this site, I really do. And if you call it whining... I thought this was the feedback section? Even if I was whining it sure as he'll makes the forum look bad. I say we seek help.

It's not that it's pointless. It serves a reason to have, and that reason is to show valor for people who deserve it. People won't leave because we have so many ranks, in fact, most nubs ASK for ranks up front. We get this a lot at ELR, and we just firmly tell them that they won't get it if they ask. Ranks are not suppose to be easy to get, and it's not impossible to get them. People just don't deserve them. The way your speaking, "Let's just be a mono-tone society and follow our sole dictator, Rabid." That's what I can see from taking away all our ranks and powers from other members. Elites mod their own sections, whist somewhat undercover. LCC makes collabs, LRL's participate. Ect.

No one will get a rank if they don't deserve it. Just because people don't deserve ranks makes you feel bad, it doesn't mean it's pointless or worth less. It does come off as whining, and if you want to be taken seriously, you need more appropriate reasoning that people can agree with.

P.S. You can't complain without receiving criticism, you can't try to agree with something without receiving criticism.

P.S.S. I half-support your idea. Everyone is complaining about how LR is too elitist and is driving people away, if that's the case, it's justifiable to eliminate the competitive nature of LR. This means all ranks coordinating to skill, and LR battles. Will anyone be willing to do this? No. It's easy for the people who don't play anymore or as much to go along with it, but for people who are still at the peek of their game, it's not going to happen.

Someone respond to my post. I'm dying to argue. I dislike being ignored.

If people play for fun and don't care about standards, they are less likely to share their tracks

Well I don't know about that - there is a middle ground where people play for fun and not care about standards but will still go through the trouble of recording.
When they start playing and not recording their tracks ever it becomes inactivity.

If someone who has decided not to care as much about standards does post their track, it's likely to get highly negative feedback because it's not as good as past tracks by them
This happens even with tracks people do work hard on, and can be extremely devastating
This is a highly complex and interrelated issue, but I think you see what I'm getting at. The structure of our community can be heavily discouraging.

Agreed~

I don't know of one forum that doesn't have a rank of "VIP MEMBER" or something like that. Speaking of which, I'd say LCC is the most justified rank of them all.

Also, asking for a rank up is like asking for a promotion. It's an extremely touchy subject, even more so when people actually deeply care about them.

Inukaza wrote:It's not that it's pointless. It serves a reason to have, and that reason is to show valor for people who deserve it. People won't leave because we have so many ranks, in fact, most nubs ASK for ranks up front. We get this a lot at ELR, and we just firmly tell them that they won't get it if they ask. Ranks are not suppose to be easy to get, and it's not impossible to get them. People just don't deserve them. The way your speaking, "Let's just be a mono-tone society and follow our sole dictator, Rabid." That's what I can see from taking away all our ranks and powers from other members. Elites mod their own sections, whist somewhat undercover. LCC makes collabs, LRL's participate. Ect.

No one will get a rank if they don't deserve it. Just because people don't deserve ranks makes you feel bad, it doesn't mean it's pointless or worth less. It does come off as whining, and if you want to be taken seriously, you need more appropriate reasoning that people can agree with.

P.S. You can't complain without receiving criticism, you can't try to agree with something without receiving criticism.

P.S.S. I half-support your idea. Everyone is complaining about how LR is too elitist and is driving people away, if that's the case, it's justifiable to eliminate the competitive nature of LR. This means all ranks coordinating to skill, and LR battles. Will anyone be willing to do this? No. It's easy for the people who don't play anymore or as much to go along with it, but for people who are still at the peek of their game, it's not going to happen.

Someone respond to my post. I'm dying to argue. I dislike being ignored.

*clap clap* This was what was in my head from 2010 all the way till now. I just didn't think my opinions would be important enough to give a damn

Rabid, even though you are one of the nicer admins that i've seen, your decisions of keeping the ranks pointless and impossible to reach is really bothering me. So many times have i said that the ranks are the goals of all the beginners, it's like getting to 2nd prestige on Cod, it's like getting to level 100 on maplestory, it's like getting respect in real life. You say that they're not deserving? Then create more ranks or categories so they feel like at least they've taken a milestone in their accomplishments. You don't need to make a rank inferior to another rank, how about "Bla bla scenery maker bla bla" and "bla bla manual maker bla bla" and [censored] like that. And with the idea of downgrading everyone's skills in linerider has too many flaws in it. Liiike, if everyone sucked, and one person was like the god, everyone would want to be better than the god to receive positive reputation. Then we would be going back to normal.

Even if we solve this issue, it's going to be the same things over and over for the next few years. I think the only way to resolve this problem is to somehow get a blasphemous amount of people to join our forum, so there would be more variety, and more groups. These days it's just the LCC pulling tracks out, not much greys are.

tl;dr : Get rid of LCC, or get more ranks. And also the idea i've suggested about 3 months ago was completely ignored, and here i push it again.

rabid squirrel wrote:

TigerXLine wrote:* Every who is beasts at Line Rider quits. From what I've read above, the problem is that none have the guts to keep training them selves or deal with not being as good as Aspi or Kram... (This suggestion was a joke, but also a point).

Did you seriously just suggest that? Did you seriously just ask all of the LCC to quit so that there will be more activity in Line Rider?

Uuhmm...... >.> "(This suggestion was a joke, but also a point)"

So wait. This is an argument about the merits of colored names given to elected people who are the most proficient at incorrectly using a hastily designed flash game created to pass a college project, and, this is also a wonderfully vicious debate about the boastfulness of those most proficient at using the game incorrectly, as their inability to use the game in a reasonably correct fashion indicates their proud rebellion against the conformity of drawing a pencil mountain with trees and crap, which is, of course, off putting to new members, which is naturally the reason behind the lack of said new members.

Maybe most people just think linerider is much less interesting than we do.

Why not try to get Evolution of Line Rider and BS or something in Machinima?
We have really nothing to loose...

I agree with wizzy. The ranks are not really necessary. Just mods and admins should be marked.

To the other points i don't have to say really much. U have all brilliant ideas.

I don't know how you feel after reading and discussing all these comments but i want to restart the whole forum, praise all the sceners and SCENE A DAMN [censored] CAVE ADVENTURE

rabid squirrel wrote:1. You said that you were out of inspiration after KING because "everyone keeps expecting that whatever I make has to be better than my last track"
2. I said there was some overlap
3. You quit for quite a long while

1. True
2. True
3. True

You are the Rabid of truths
My post was just how I feel now I guess, back then I was still competitive, I think I care a bit less now, but maybe not. Iunno
I just know I like playing Line Rider again

I don't like all these new ttc's

Painlobster wrote:So wait. This is an argument about the merits of colored names given to elected people who are the most proficient at incorrectly using a hastily designed flash game created to pass a college project, and, this is also a wonderfully vicious debate about the boastfulness of those most proficient at using the game incorrectly, as their inability to use the game in a reasonably correct fashion indicates their proud rebellion against the conformity of drawing a pencil mountain with trees and crap, which is, of course, off putting to new members, which is naturally the reason behind the lack of said new members.

Maybe most people just think linerider is much less interesting than we do.

No, the argument was that linerider is dying. It somehow shifted to the opinion that it's dying because we have too many ranks. People are complaining in another opinion that we are not receiving new members due to LR being too elitist. No one is saying those elitist people are killing us, not one person did. Rather, I personally claimed that it's one thing to whine about it, and another to do something. If people feel strong about LR being too elitist, you should get rid of the competitive edge. Also, I'm going to put on the record that I just suggested it, I'm not advocating it aggressively.

And again, I agree with your last statement. I said this in my first post in this thread yesterday. It's as simple as the fact that Linerider is old.

Linerider is old.

old.