LR Loom [07 OCT 2014 1.2 Alpha]

Alpha 1.2 links 07 OCT 2014
OSX: https://www.dropbox.com/s/r36jzlf2x9hnhf8/lrloom1.2osx.zip?dl=0
Windows: https://www.dropbox.com/s/8ecq8vs20der6iy/lrloom1.2windows.zip?dl=0

Alpha 1.1 links 21 AUG 2014
OSX: https://www.dropbox.com/s/28218g3ixpovf22/LR%20Loom%20Alpha%201.0%20OSX.zip
Windows: https://www.dropbox.com/s/buuk7yh7rayglsb/LR%20Loom%20Alpha%201.0%20Win.zip

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Old project I've had sitting on the back burner for a long time now, and something I've kept relatively hush hush. Only mentioning this on occasion. I started this to pick up after Mhenr abandoned the C++ build he was making.

Loom is an open source game engine that I discovered way back ago when the game "contraption maker", the spiritual successor to "the incredible machine", fell into my steam library. First thing that piqued my interest was that there was an in game recorder that would make videos on your contraption solutions. So I did a bit of research and found out that Loom is actually pretty awesome. This video here shows off one of my favorite features https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMxvyB1fMNY

What really hooked me was the easy multiple platform build support, which had been something I've been wanting in a game engine. This meant I wouldn't have to worry about different API's or foundation scripting, the engine did all that hard work for me. Assuming I could make something in the first place.

I haven't really made much progress since I started, I've been having a very difficult time learning loomscript. However, I've been able to pull out a lot more motivation thanks to the meds I've been on for a week now, and have regained my interest in this. I won't be trying to make this the full fancy schmancy build we've always been wanting, or to compete with any other builds being made, I'm just using this medium as a way to help teach myself Loom. The reason I'm using LR should be obvious. It's already a familiar program to me, and learning how to adapt things from as2 to loomscript will teach me how the code fundamentally works. Because at some day in my life... I'd like to make my own IP for once, a game that I can call my own, and Loom so far has been the best engine I've ever found.

I'll be providing downloads for both osx and windows for everyone to show off my progress whenever I feel I've made a significant amount.


Old downloads, but you can still screw with them.
OSX: https://www.dropbox.com/s/wfbmzgr5cyny131/lrloomosx.zip
Windows: https://www.dropbox.com/s/h5t23td76jvv0ur/lrloomwindows.zip
Linux/Ubuntu: Not yet available via Loom SDK, but I will provide one when it is.

EDIT: What it can do now:
Dynamically adjusts UI when windows resizes.
Click and drag to see mouse position.
Re-size the window and it'll tell you what size.
Press 1-3 to change swatch.

(also btw, if you care, it pulls off 60 fps. i wish I could display that, but currently loom doesn't support an easy way other than what I can see via developer console https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SgmgnYvnKx8)

Thanks.

Actually substantial porting! And you wonder why I fanboy.

I'm gonna have to look into Loom, because from what you're telling us, it's rather friendly to work with.

As posted in the chat, by kevansevans:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SgmgnYvnKx8 (idk if you wanted that shared or not but I actually sat there and watched it for ten whole minutes. I have no life. The background images were probably what kept me going.)

Lag test with 30,000 "lines" (which are basicaly just an image which is just generated and sits there as an object from what I gathered.)
Appears to be speedy, but these aren't actual lines, mind you. It's also in edit mode. The real deal is when Bosh is in play. First, we'd need a Bosh.
Got zoom, yet?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfFPO53sL4Q

Dapianokid wrote:As posted in the chat, by kevansevans:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SgmgnYvnKx8

Oh the wonders of actually reading the original post.

I didn't care to actually watch the video. What makes the pencil behave that way?

I think I'm starting to remember why I dislike fanboys >.>

Got another alpha to put out for you guys. Basic pencil drawing has been implemented. I want to test frame rate with this build with duplicating lines. Currently the engine is duplicating an image that looks like a line, as you may of noticed in my above video, and there for won't operate as smooth as I want it to. I am currently researching drawing methods like flash does, IE dynamic vector drawing, and will implement that as soon as I find it.

Loomscript does not offer an easy way to display frame rate, the only ways it can be seen is on my end in the developers console, or developer statistics that will only allow me to operate/run the program while those are enabled. If you have Fraps to view frame rate, I highly encourage that method. What I want tested is at what point does frame rate recovery stop. While drawing, it will naturally drop to around 20 fps (due to image duplication), but will recover back to 59 fps. Why not 60? Idk, highest I ever see it go is 59. But at the point where you see it unable to get back to that 55 - 59 range, that's when I'd like to hear about it.


OSX: https://www.dropbox.com/s/sfogw5evag00662/osxLRLoomAlpha2.zip
Windows: https://www.dropbox.com/s/li3nh06xn712eip/windowsLRLoomAlpha2.zip

You can move the canvas via arrow keys. Sorry about not being able to drag with hand tool, still trying to figure out how that works, otherwise I'd have that implemented already. Thank you for your time.

EDIT: Message from the loom SDK developers:

There is not currently a vector drawing API in Loom, so you'll have to stick with your current method.

He did however give me an alternative way of drawing lines, and have somewhat been implemented. reduced the fps drop from 40 fps to 20 fps, and is now dependant on screen view, so drawing in a blank area will yield the same results as drawing on an empty canvas.

Got basic contact points working. That dot trail you see is one point being duplicated in it's new positions.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/30169277/Screenshot%202014-06-29%2013.58.44.png

Spoiler:

Got some basic physics working and some aesthetics. If you press play, you'll see a crude simulation with red and blue lines and bosh flying around.

Windows https://www.dropbox.com/s/gunvl8wkgdafngy/lrloomwindows0.0.2.zip
OSX https://www.dropbox.com/s/1i3rzru8werh6jh/lrosx0.0.2.zip

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-eJPMibvmk

Thinking of re-naming the line sin the editor to better describe their behavior, rather than letting the player figure out what they do.



There's going to be a few features that I want to implement that will make color labels a little confusing to have, so describing their behavior is a lot easier. Let me know wwhat you guys think.

The following post is me discussing future concepts that I do plan on adding, please feel free to toss in your two cents. Please don't discuss features or ideas you want added unless it's to suggest a better option that what I've already conceived in my following paragraphs. Aesthetics will be focused on when I actually have a playable build.

So part of this build is going to be optimizing and or streamlining the user interface. One thing I'm planning on removing is the zoom tool. Don't Panic. You'll still be able to use the scroll wheel to zoom in and out, and for more precise zooming, a slider/step counter will be added to imitate the zoom tool. The new tool I plan on implementing however is an expansion on the hand tool. More specifically, a pointer setting.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/30169277/handPointTool.png

Spoiler:

This tool will allow us to drag and drop lines, by the end points of each line, or to even move the start point. Yes, I'm dedicating a tool to specifically move the start point, it's so much cleaner than allowing you to move it with whatever tool you want. This pointer tool will also give a way to access line properties.

The way I want to handle line properties is to give the player the option to edit every single lines behavior for the final edit. Definite additions will be visual properties, such as hue, brightness, and color (which has been something I've always wanted to see happen). Other ideas I have conceived are line type swapping, and contact point reactions, where the player could specify which points will affect bosh. This I think is cool because we could have grinds made possible, without the need of inventing a whole new line type. Before drawing lines, the player can set specific options in a menu before hand (hot key ` for tool settings, since zoom will no longer be on the toolbar, the shortcut keys move over one and I can finally give the options panel a letter hotkey). Via the pointer tool, the menu can be accessed and will allow the player to adjust lines on the fly, either one by one, or selected group upon highlighting or holding shift to select multiple. In the options panel, settings will be provided to force every line into their default behavior, and even isolating specific attributes, so if the player has taken advantage of 'grind mode', the line will still behave the same.

While in the editor, everything will look like beta 2. Blue lines will be blue, green will be green, red will be red. Activating preview mode (Shift+Enter/Return) will show the lines true nature, assuming color has been applied to them. Otherwise you'll see nothing but black. When built in recording will be implemented, there will be two videos exported. The "final' version that has all the super duper visual effects the player has added, and a colored version that has no effects, no color, no scenery, just all the red and blue lines.

Thanks for reading.

awesome, waiting. how long will it take do you think?

First Alpha build I've made:

OSX https://www.dropbox.com/s/28218g3ixpovf22/LR%20Loom%20Alpha%201.0%20OSX.zip
Windows https://www.dropbox.com/s/buuk7yh7rayglsb/LR%20Loom%20Alpha%201.0%20Win.zip

Can:
Draw with pencil, blue and red swatch available.
Press play and stop
Pan with hand tool
Zoom with scroll wheel
Reset canvas with trash

Can not:
Do everything else

Know bugs:
Rider starts in fakie, acts in odd manner
Resizing window disables playback, resize at title screen to prevent issue.

Enjoy!

swag

Somebody pinch me

already told you stuff in chat but also posting

- anti-aliasing graphics
- pencil and hand don't reselect after playing or at start of game. confusing.
- live draw all the time
- can trash track while he's riding it
- lag appears to be about 2x as much as beta 2

So just recently I got back from a discussion with one of the Loom developers and told him about my project. He seemed supportive of the project and willing to help when ia sk (He already has actually and is super duper awesome). One point he brought up was if I considered making it a clone. And I have, but i explained that Line Rider comes first, and if inxile allows me to publish, than that's what it'll be. A proper Line Rider port. But this did get me thinking.

Assuming I get turned down, would you guys mind playing a "clone"? To me clone holds a very negative connotation in my opinion, if the phrase "Doom clone" is familiar to you, than you know what I'm getting at. To me, calling something a clone means I lack in the originality department, and yes I know that what I'm doing now isn't original but the point is if I can avoid having that word attached to the final product, that's better for me. But, my question to everyone here, would you'd be willing to convert to a "clone" assuming it functioned as identical as I legally could make it, or will you guys not mind if I stop the project there?


IN OTHER NEWS:

Development has made a massive progress as now I have a storage system that will significantly reduce the amount of lag experienced when running the simulation. But in the process I sort of broke it, so I'm in hot heat rebuilding the code, and making it stronger I might add, so it can work properly again. After that's complete, next feature will be saving. Once saving it completed, I'll run some final bug testing in an open/closed beta (haven't decided), then release it as an official beta. At this point is when I'll approach InXile for permission, so cross your fingers for me

[senpai] kevans wrote:At this point is when I'll approach InXile for permission, so cross your fingers for me

This has been sitting on my thoughts for some time, and I feel the need to express my opinion on this matter. I don't think you have the right to distribute and make money of LR as it if were you own. I know you've been talking about wanting to release it on Steam, and I completely disagree with you. I can't stop you, but I personally think you do not deserve to be doing anything of the sort.

Shotoku wrote:

[senpai] kevans wrote:At this point is when I'll approach InXile for permission, so cross your fingers for me

This has been sitting on my thoughts for some time, and I feel the need to express my opinion on this matter. I don't think you have the right to distribute and make money of LR as it if were you own. I know you've been talking about wanting to release it on Steam, and I completely disagree with you. I can't stop you, but I personally think you do not deserve to be doing anything of the sort.

This is why I'm asking permission to distribute it. If you saw my full explanation, I have been saying that making money would be a nice option, but not necessarily something I'm completely concerned over. If they can put it on steam for me, I'll argue my damn best to make sure it's free. If I have to put it through greenlight, that's 100 dollars out of my pocket to even have permission to put anything on steam. If that's how it goes, I will want to charge, but to give everyone a fair opportunity to get this for free, it will be free for as long as it takes me to make a Non-beta build, and even then I'll give every one here two months notice before it gets to that point, so there's no excuse for not taking the time for one more account. And that's also a pretty damn long time considering it's taken me four years or so to get where I'm at with the flash builds.

tl;dr: I'm only charging if I have to shell out money to put it on steam.

Posted update. This is not Beta 1 build.

Big feature in this one is now the simulation can run at 40 FPS, meaning this build will have an easier time replicating the physics from the flash builds.

Scenery lines were added.
Grid system was added, meaning collision detection has been optimized and can support eraser and snapping when implemented.

and other stuff, enjoy!

https://www.reddit.com/r/linerider/comments/3gecrq/line_rider_loom_alpha_4/

Kevans has a significant update! Go to the subreddit to find out! Any contact or comments you want to make with him or about his work should be directed toward and made in the subreddit

He's still making progress! Go check it out!!!

Literally nothing works in the OSX version. Can't click on anything. *shrugs*

EDIT: opened in parallels on windows 7. froze. *shrugs*

Go post that in the subreddit.

Kind of inconvenient, the fact that all clicking is translated into the top left quadrant. I don't have a reddit account and do not plan to have one, and all I can say is the drawing looks smooth enough, and the transition between simulation and editor is cut and dry.

Dapianokid wrote:Go post that in the subreddit.

eh