My problem with power

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

My problem with power

Post by Fauxfyre on Wed Apr 10, 2013 2:41 pm

I've been getting bothered by some comments on tracks recently, here are a few that came up just this month.
Rafael wrote:Some flings still seemed a bit halfassed (like you could have stacked them a bit more)
Sssschiller wrote:I think you should work a little bit on the strenght and pressure in your curves Smile
roflmaoqwerty wrote:You might benefit from working on the thinking-in-frames process a little more, since your flings aren't really as strong as they can be.
Opal Rider wrote:I'm not sure what to feel about this one. Some of the weaker wells seemed a bit out of place, compared to the others, although it wasn't a terrible track overall.
Many of these comments where good and constructive criticism, but the thing I don't like is the focus on power for every track nowadays.

Manuals/manuquirk? Keep pressure in the manuals and have the gwells strong.
Fling quirk? Make sure your gwell pulls are really strong in the fling or have complex asdfs.
Alt quirk / xy? Fast moving tracks are usually liked better than lulzy ones.

I was talking with someone on Skype about how he was depressed he was because he couldn't do an asdf, or make a really strong fling quirk. I tried to tell him how jealous I was of his skills in other areas, but he insisted that his problem with his tracks was he couldn't get them powerful enough or get complex tricks done well.

I personally don't like how people bitch about how I don't stack my flings when I'm on stream, because I personally like how things look when Bosh isn't being pulled to his limits in god knows how many directions at once. I like smooth and flowy tracks, but popular demand nowadays seem like power quirk tracks are the only ones that get constantly great reviews. I really like slower tracks, flowy tracks, but they seem to be losing steam nowadays because of the paradigm that every track needs power to be good.

Looking at the 4 most recently featured tracks, 3 of them are focused on power and really complex flings. Is that the only way we can make a really good track is to do epic power quirk? This disturbs me. I don't like to make that kind of track, but it seems like whenever I do parts like that in my tracks, they are the parts people like the most. I got pissed off because in my track Smile, my least favorite part was the high speed at the end, but that was the only part people would talk about.

Scenery is less prevalent nowadays because it is hard to scene quirk, which is what many people are doing nowadays. Nearly every scenery track is praised well, but people won't take the time to do them because they spend too much time trying to get a perfect bare track. I remember when I was watching videos when Line Rider first was being played, it seemed like almost any track needed scenery to be good. What happened to that?

This is NOT dumb style vs. power debate, I could care less what people think of style. I want to know why / if people think power is the focus on almost all the tracks nowadays. I would like to hear other peoples opinions on this, because it has been bothering me the last few weeks.



tl;dr I'm not liking how power is the focus of many track styles now, discuss.


Last edited by Shotoku on Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:27 pm; edited 1 time in total

Fauxfyre
Member

Featured Video: Blackheart

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Wizzy on Wed Apr 10, 2013 3:10 pm

In general it's just more up to standard to have more powerful wells, flings, etc. although you definitely don't need them to be to make a great track. If you can be creative with how you make your track, you won't have to have much power at all. In fact, some of my recent tracks hardly have very much power in them (Such as Somber Wind and Ruse) you can clearly notice I'm not going for very much power, but just a way to make it fun to watch. It is generally more widely accepted to make tracks much more powerful and balanced and is a standard style of track making, so people push that towards people as a way of improvement. If a fling is much more weak than the rest of the track, it's probably a good idea to point it out (even though the track maker can probably figure that one out, lolz.) I think it's also a good idea to mention tracks like anomaly or george, they don't have hardly any power in their tracks but they're still, like, legendary. So it's not something that's necessary but is just another way you could improve your track making abilities.

And speaking of, I'm making an all manual track right now with pretty much no power at all xD no flings, wells, anything. Just manuals. So yeah, not necessary, but more with the standards. You should just make what you want anyway. It's not about proving anything to anyone, not even yourself.

Also: Tell your friends Stallie is going to be xbox tomorrow. Thank God.

_________________
Opal Rider wrote:It's cute. But we can go danker.
avatar
Wizzy
Member


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Fauxfyre on Wed Apr 10, 2013 3:39 pm

@Wizzy, that's my point is that you don't need them to make a great track. But if anybody uses weak wells or something in their tracks they get them criticized and are told to make them stronger next time. If they have a weaker fling, stack in more next time. I agree with you completely, but it just seems like people are being pushed to always put more power in their tracks when that shouldn't be the measurement of skill.

Fauxfyre
Member

Featured Video: Blackheart

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Wizzy on Wed Apr 10, 2013 3:48 pm

Mhmm. It's just what the standard is now.

_________________
Opal Rider wrote:It's cute. But we can go danker.
avatar
Wizzy
Member


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by TeamBlast on Wed Apr 10, 2013 3:57 pm

IMO, people need to quit regulating someone on a track they made unless they asked for it. It's really sad to see all these people worried their creations are gonna get heavily criticized (constructive or not). Hell, my own tracks for a while get criticized and it sort of drove me away from the game (although some of them were pretty lame :P).

Edit: tl;dr People should be able to do the hell the want to in Line Rider. It's a toy for creativity, not a game with restrictions.


Last edited by TeamBlast on Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:03 pm; edited 1 time in total

_________________
Spoiler:

Personal project - 900 blue lines (12/25/16)
avatar
TeamBlast
Member

<CENSORED>


View user profile http://dansaunders.me/

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Opal Rider on Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:01 pm

Mine didn't exactly state that it had to be the mos powerful track in the world. It was more a nod to the consistency of the track, and making it look uniform and professional. However, having powerful flings does certainly help the directional problems, as well as rotation (depending), so it's usually a good idea in the first place. Not sure what the big deal is.

_________________
https://www.youtube.com/user/OpalRiderLR
You literally just did lines!

avatar
Opal Rider
Moderator

Aestetikally appealing


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Cereal on Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:31 pm

Flings and G-wells don't have to be as strong as possible by any means; that is a misconception.

Manuals, however, better have decently even pressure. Otherwise, you might give me cancer. 8D

I'm kinda jk about that last part (keyword: kinda) but it's important to not half-ass things if you have the ability to do so.

_________________
Times They Are A-Changin'  

>>The Ph Series<<
EXPLOSIVO

Words of Wisdom:

OTDE wrote:Be active and we'll love you forever. Make tracks and we'll love you five-ever.

FlagCapper wrote:How is a Quirk a Quirk when it becomes more of the same?

Eric Cartman wrote:If you want to find some quality friends, you've gotta wait through all the dicks first.

avatar
Cereal
Line Rider Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by roflmaoqwerty on Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:56 pm

Shotoku wrote:I personally don't like how people bitch about how I don't stack my flings when I'm on stream, because I personally like how things look when Bosh isn't being pulled to his limits in god knows how many directions at once.
TeamBlast wrote:People should be able to do the hell the want to in Line Rider. It's a toy for creativity, not a game with restrictions.
Amen, brothers.

I personally believe that a certain degree of power is necessary to make tracks alright. Don't believe me? Watch my old fling quirk and laugh at how wobbly it is.
Exhibit A.

However, too much power is definitely a bad thing, since it's either blatant showing off, impossible to follow, or both.
Exhibit B.

What I think is truly missing nowadays is the perfect balance of power and smoothness, or rather, how to make a track not far too strong, but simply at a level where the creator is afforded an equal balance of control and flow.
Exhibit C.

Despite all of this, I feel that by far the most important thing is to make tracks that you're personally proud of, regardless of how "powerful" they are. Myself, I strive for power in my tracks, and that's what I have fun doing. I'll admit that I get a little too over-the-top at times, and I admit that I yearn for the incredible command of flow that others possess.
Exhibits D, E, and F.

_________________
̿̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ ̿'̿'̵͇̿̿з=( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)=ε/̵͇̿̿/’̿’̿ ̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ L  O  O  K  W  H  O  ' S  B  A  C  K ̿̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ ̿'̿'̵͇̿̿з=( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)=ε/̵͇̿̿/’̿’̿ ̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ ̿̿

ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ノSLAM YOUR JAMヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ノ


MY NIGGA RYU ALWAYS OUT HERE. THAT NIGGA COLD ASF I FUCKS WIT RYU CUS THAT NIGGA RYU SLICK
avatar
roflmaoqwerty
Member

Dreadnips are amazing goddamn


View user profile http://www.youtube.com/user/SujiNoriteLR

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Rafael on Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:43 pm

My critics were on the fact that some of the flings looked halfassed. My explanation is that they look like they could've been stacked more, meaning that it looked like you intended to make them strong but you were too lazy to stack them some more. There, halfassed.
I would actually love to see people experiment with weak flings, since they can change the pace of a track if it's done right.
See it this way: All the styles that you named are ALL styles where it's normal to create a high pace. And if you want a high pace, you need to add strong wells. If you don't have strong wells, the force with which Bosh is being pulled (or pushed)counteracts the high pace because Bosh changes direction (and other movements) more slowly, and THAT is what makes the weak wells seem sloppy.
If you create a very low paced track, then strong wells will actually look out of place. A slow manual track with an insane nose-spidey asdf is strange. The asdf counteracts the slow pace that the track is aiming for. Therefore that will look way more awkward than a normal fling.
Conclusive I think it's not the strong wells that have become a standard, but the requirement of a fast pace in tracks before they can be considered impressive. A shame to see, really.

2 cents
avatar
Rafael
Line Rider Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by efrazable on Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:04 pm

Shotoku wrote:Scenery is less prevalent nowadays because it is hard to scene quirk, which is what many people are doing nowadays [...] We spend too much time trying to get a perfect bare track.
1. This shotoku guy makes quirks as a preference.
2. Scenery isnt being held back by lack of possible tracks. Thats like saying there arent enough christmas trees to dress up.
3. You cant tell people what to enjoy
4. I would generally agree that the skill gap is doing a number on our rate of new members.
5. Nothing is wrong with critique unless they would probably quit if you judged them too harshly.

_________________
LineMagiX wrote:hump
avatar
efrazable
Member

Durr I'm efraz herp derp


View user profile http://www.youtube.com/user/efrazable?feature=mhee

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Fauxfyre on Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:26 pm

@Rafael
I see where you're coming from, I think you are completely right. A lot of my rant came from people's reviews on tracks, telling them to always make them "stronger", which is just starting to get annoying to me, especially when I'm told I half-assed my flings because I didn't want to stack them. Thanks for your input though.

@Efrazable
That was just mostly left over from another conversation that I really should have left out. I am being kind of hypocritical there, and you made very good points on calling me out on it.

Okay, thanks for discussing this guys, I'm done ranting.

Fauxfyre
Member

Featured Video: Blackheart

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Yobanjojoe on Wed Apr 10, 2013 11:27 pm

Actually the reason there aren't as many sceners is because scenery takes a shit load more effort then track making

Why?

Because if you want to make a huge scenery track you have to split the track. Which means finding the perfect place to make the splits then editing it back into a full movie. (Unless your playing line rider on a blue gene)

Also large scenery tracks, if you want them to be done well generally take several months to complete.

_________________
Where am I



avatar
Yobanjojoe
Member

swag


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by rabid squirrel on Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:19 am

Roflmaoqwerty, Shotoku, and Rafael made excellent posts and I don't really have anything to add to what hey said.
efrazable wrote:
Shotoku wrote:Scenery is less prevalent nowadays because it is hard to scene quirk, which is what many people are doing nowadays [...] We spend too much time trying to get a perfect bare track.
2. Scenery isnt being held back by lack of possible tracks. Thats like saying there arent enough christmas trees to dress up.
Yobanjo speaks the truth - scenery takes more time and effort to get ANYTHING that is considered decent and original out there.

However, I disagree with efrazable. Tracks people are making nowadays are harder and harder to scene. Quirks don't make sense in a realistic environment. More and more tracks are all about curves, which are hard to scene, and power and speed, which make scenery difficult in other ways. Even manual tracks have things that frustrate sceners like curves that cross (ugh), large "even-pressure" curves (guess we have to make more rails. that's original), not to mention alt flings (wtf do we do with those) gaps in curves bosh goes through (options become very limited) flings that cross over track parts, elevators, and then you have your fucking stacked flings because anything not stacked is "half-assed". these are all considered normal or even necessary for tracks dubbed "manual tracks". Thus, nobody wants to scene because it's HARD and because nobody wants to make a track that would be easy to scene.

_________________
Support My Art
A playlist of my best tracks
To keep up with what I'm up to in the world of Line Rider, follow me:
My Twitter | My Tumblr | My Twitch | My Facebook Page | My Instagram
(You can also follow my patreon and see all public posts completely for free)
avatar
rabid squirrel
Member

I'm the artsy guy round here

Community Pick: Braggadocio
3rd place in Tournament of Legends 4th place in Tournament of Legends

View user profile http://www.benjaminharveydesign.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by SPL4SHZ0N3 on Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:55 am

case in point of weaker wells being impressive because they fit with a theme or feeling : Contrails by SCG.

I think certain tricks have different feels. Most probably because we have seen so many different tracks and eventually relate different emotions/memories/feelings to certain images that we see, both with the lines themselves and bosh's movements. A lot of times the feeling the trackmaker wants to portray becomes revealed with the title of the track. weaker wells are lighter, airy, and have a sense of gliding (especially obvious with tricks where the actual pulling isn't visual like the nose, tail, even foot. the trick feels even more airy/light when by itself on the screen. more white space = more light) Stronger wells are usually more violent, sometimes proud (this is where music comes into the presentation) and can be more energetic. This seems pretty obvious once stated I think, or I may be reading too much into a toy. Maybe the toy has developed to become something more than 'just' a toy. Regardless, i hope this helps.

_________________
"There is something to be learned from a rainstorm. When meeting with a sudden shower, you try not to get wet and run quickly along the road. But doing such things as passing under the eaves of houses, you still get wet. When you are resolved from the beginning, you will not be perplexed, though you still get the same soaking."
Youtube
avatar
SPL4SHZ0N3
Line Rider Legend


View user profile http://www.youtube.com/user/SPL4SHZ0N3

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Votale on Thu Apr 11, 2013 10:58 am

I have a large problem with the concept of "power" as well as "inspiration" when it comes to Line Rider.

For some reason, some people feel that the point of a track is to make every fling/well (even manuals) as "powerful" as possible. You guys are retarded (the ones who think that). Would a strong-ass Sheldon/Kram fling/ASDF fit in a georgio track? Point being, Georgio makes flings not necessarily as powerful as they can be because it doesn't fit his style of trackmaking, so stop commenting on every track saying that a manual should possess more pressure, or a fling should be stacked/stronger (especially as if power makes all tracks better).

When it comes to "inspiration" some people just annoy me in that area. To be "inspired" is simply to want to play Line Rider in a certain way. I'll see a Georgio track and be like "Wow I really want to make something like that!" Then I go and do that. Or I think of a cool idea for a track and I'm just like "That'd be fun to make I'm gonna go do that." It's not what dramatic song I choose. It's not how much effort I put into the power of my flings or my manuals. It's simply being influenced or encouraged to play the game by another track I see or an idea that I have. You can't just say "Wow you put no heart into those manuals, therefore you must have been uninspired while you made this." I sometimes want to play LR a lot, but that doesn't mean I'm going to put 100% effort into every trick. lol I play to have fun.
avatar
Votale
Member


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Rafael on Thu Apr 11, 2013 11:40 am

I agree with Votale, but we have a different interpretation of the word "inspired".
avatar
Rafael
Line Rider Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by rabid squirrel on Fri Apr 12, 2013 12:34 am

SPL4SHZ0N3 wrote:case in point of weaker wells being impressive because they fit with a theme or feeling : Contrails by SCG.
Yes perfect thank you!
Votale wrote:When it comes to "inspiration" some people just annoy me in that area. To be "inspired" is simply to want to play Line Rider in a certain way. I'll see a Georgio track and be like "Wow I really want to make something like that!" Then I go and do that. Or I think of a cool idea for a track and I'm just like "That'd be fun to make I'm gonna go do that." It's not what dramatic song I choose. It's not how much effort I put into the power of my flings or my manuals. It's simply being influenced or encouraged to play the game by another track I see or an idea that I have. You can't just say "Wow you put no heart into those manuals, therefore you must have been uninspired while you made this." I sometimes want to play LR a lot, but that doesn't mean I'm going to put 100% effort into every trick. lol I play to have fun.
It's sort of a tricky concept to define. Something between entertainment and inspiration. Like... the desire to present something that both you and the audience will enjoy. So if I make a manual and don't really care, that would be less of that, and if I work really hard to make it look nice, that would be more of that. If you don't want to call it inspiration, that's cool, and you're right it's different... but I dunno what to call it >.<

_________________
Support My Art
A playlist of my best tracks
To keep up with what I'm up to in the world of Line Rider, follow me:
My Twitter | My Tumblr | My Twitch | My Facebook Page | My Instagram
(You can also follow my patreon and see all public posts completely for free)
avatar
rabid squirrel
Member

I'm the artsy guy round here

Community Pick: Braggadocio
3rd place in Tournament of Legends 4th place in Tournament of Legends

View user profile http://www.benjaminharveydesign.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by shammies on Fri Apr 12, 2013 2:36 am

rabid squirrel wrote: but I dunno what to call it >.<
Motivation... or that's what I call it.
Whenever I see a new/old track, that I enjoy, it motivates me and drives me to make an amazing track.
It's how it works for me.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

_________________
Spoiler:
avatar
shammies
Member

I'm the auts guy around here!


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Wizzy on Fri Apr 12, 2013 2:46 am

Why are we debating what the definition of/what inspiration is... have we really come to that?

_________________
Opal Rider wrote:It's cute. But we can go danker.
avatar
Wizzy
Member


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by rabid squirrel on Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:15 am

shammies wrote:
rabid squirrel wrote: but I dunno what to call it >.<
Motivation... or that's what I call it.
Whenever I see a new/old track, that I enjoy, it motivates me and drives me to make an amazing track.
It's how it works for me.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Wizzy wrote:Why are we debating what the definition of/what inspiration is... have we really come to that?
can you guys actually read my post please and thank you

also note that votale was the first person to mention inspiration in this thread he just felt like bitching about it even thought it's unrelated :P

_________________
Support My Art
A playlist of my best tracks
To keep up with what I'm up to in the world of Line Rider, follow me:
My Twitter | My Tumblr | My Twitch | My Facebook Page | My Instagram
(You can also follow my patreon and see all public posts completely for free)
avatar
rabid squirrel
Member

I'm the artsy guy round here

Community Pick: Braggadocio
3rd place in Tournament of Legends 4th place in Tournament of Legends

View user profile http://www.benjaminharveydesign.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Wizzy on Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:32 am

I'd call it a standard. A standard manual having good pressure, perfect balance, etc. It's what people look for and strive for, but is not a necessity for good track making.

I'm repeating my first post again, and I think pretty much everyone else has to some extent in this thread. @splsh about contrails by SCG - See my first post.

_________________
Opal Rider wrote:It's cute. But we can go danker.
avatar
Wizzy
Member


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Votale on Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:43 am

rabid squirrel wrote:
also note that votale was the first person to mention inspiration in this thread he just felt like bitching about it even thought it's unrelated :P

Helllll yeah I was. And I mentioned it because since we're all complaining about technical terms in LR here I'd rather mention it here than create a new thread about it. And yeah that's just my interpretation or inspiration, not everyone's. You have a well-rounded definition of it as well @ Rabid.
avatar
Votale
Member


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by rabid squirrel on Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:20 am

on second read it looks like shammies actually did read my post so sorry shammies

so it seems like we all call this thing different things... inspiration, motivation, standard, entertainment... but what we're all getting at doesn't really have a word.

_________________
Support My Art
A playlist of my best tracks
To keep up with what I'm up to in the world of Line Rider, follow me:
My Twitter | My Tumblr | My Twitch | My Facebook Page | My Instagram
(You can also follow my patreon and see all public posts completely for free)
avatar
rabid squirrel
Member

I'm the artsy guy round here

Community Pick: Braggadocio
3rd place in Tournament of Legends 4th place in Tournament of Legends

View user profile http://www.benjaminharveydesign.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Rafael on Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:32 am

That desire is just motivation, and the "enjoying yourself and entertaining others" part would be the source of the motivation.
avatar
Rafael
Line Rider Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: My problem with power

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum